Post by EagleGene on Aug 7, 2006 6:05:49 GMT -5
Canton miss prospects
By Charles Robinson, Yahoo! Sports
August 6, 2006
CANTON, Ohio – Maybe Norv Turner looks at Art Monk and frets over Michael Irvin's Pro Football Hall of Fame fortunes. Maybe he knows now is the time for an impassioned push. Or maybe he just sees other supposed shoo-in candidates on the horizon – like Washington Redskins great Darrell Green – and cringes at the thought of who will go in first.
"There are a couple of corners that are going to be up here in the next several years," Turner said, referring to Green's candidacy in 2008 and Deion Sanders' likely induction in 2010. "If they go in before Michael, it's not right. Because they never covered him. If a guy goes and catches nine balls for 160 yards on you, you shouldn't go in before him.
"Put on the Atlanta film in 1992. Michael wore Deion out down there. And we had to win a game to win the division. It's like what Al Davis said about John Madden. It took 25 years to get (Madden) into the Hall of Fame, and he has a winning record against seven (coaches) that are in the Hall of Fame."
And thus, the campaigning for Irvin began in earnest Saturday, with Turner banging the first drum only moments after Troy Aikman's induction speech. It's a beat that will be heard in various cities around the nation, with the next batch of Hall of Fame candidates likely to stir some of the most rousing debates in recent memory – from the annual Art Monk campaign in Washington to the pushes for Thurman Thomas in Buffalo and Derrick Thomas in Kansas City.
In fact, only one candidate appears to be an absolute lock in '07, and he's not even a former player. The one certain nod goes to the current NFL commish, Paul Tagliabue. That is, if he ever actually retires. (It should happen later this month).
So let the debate of greatness begin. Here is a look at some of the top candidates in 2007:
Paul Tagliabue, NFL commissioner
I know there are going to be some voters who grumble about the guy – and say he's riding the coattails of a league destined to blossom – but that's rubbish. The health and overall success of the game is more paramount than any statistical record in existence. So there shouldn't be much debate here, particularly after Tagliabue pulled off one of his crowning moments in the last round of rugged collective bargaining negotiations. Other feathers in his cap: The NFL's stadium infrastructure has been practically reborn under his watch; the league has risen to unparalleled profitability and popularity in American sports; he has helped the NFL avoid the labor pitfalls and scandals that have floored the NBA, NHL and Major League Baseball. Tagliabue has had as much of an impact in his era as Pete Rozelle did in the previous regime. Enough said. Put him in.
Bruce Matthews, offensive lineman
Despite the lack of Super Bowl hardware, Matthews was clearly one of the best offensive lineman in his era, tying a league record with 14 consecutive Pro Bowls in 19 seasons (the other guy to achieve that honor, Merlin Olsen, has been enshrined). Matthews has the kind of credentials that Hall of Fame voters like – he played his entire career for one franchise; he played all three positions on the line over his career and made the Pro Bowl as both a tackle and center; and he blocked for a Hall of Famer in Earl Campbell (not to mention Eddie George in his latter years with the Tennessee Titans). The one thing that will be held against him and could even keep him out on the first ballot (weird things happen with the voters) is the lack of a Super Bowl ring. But Olsen didn't have one, either, and for that matter, neither did Anthony Munoz, who was the other great tackle during Matthews' era. Both of those guys went in as soon as they were eligible, and Matthews should be a first-ballot guy, too.
Thurman Thomas, running back
Thomas had five Pro Bowl appearances and eight consecutive 1,000-yard seasons – and of course, four unsuccessful Super Bowl appearances. While he never won a league rushing title, people tend to forget that he was Marshall Faulk before you ever heard of Marshall Faulk. Thomas led the league in yards from scrimmage from 1989 to 1992 – a span in which he averaged an impressive 10-plus yards per catch on 229 receptions. And no doubt about it, he was the trigger for Buffalo's Run-N-Shoot offense. The problem voters are going to have with Thomas? He doesn't have a great deal of marquee moments, didn't put up great numbers in his Super Bowl appearances and averaged less than four yards per carry in his last four 1,000-yard seasons. It probably won't be his year in 2007. And if it isn't, he might begin to fade as his glory years get further away.
Bob Kuechenberg, offensive lineman
A six-time Pro Bowler who spent his entire 15-year playing career with the Miami Dolphins (including the undefeated 1972 team), Kuechenberg has been on the cusp of induction the last few years. He made the cut to the top 10 candidates three of the last four years, including 2006. Among the attractive qualities for voters is the fact that he was considered one of the best (some say the best) guards of his era and he blocked for multiple Hall of Famers in Dan Marino, Bob Griese, Paul Warfield and Larry Csonka. One other factor: Having been eligible since 1990, he's nearing the end of his active term and appears to be close to induction, which may sway some votes in his favor. That may be the trick in 2007.
Derrick Thomas, linebacker
Amassing 126½ sacks and earning Pro Bowl honors in nine of his 11 seasons with the Kansas City Chiefs, Thomas was one of the most dominant pass-rushing linebackers of his era, if not NFL history. He holds the single-game sack record, notching seven against Seattle (the Chiefs lost the game, a fact which might be brought up among voters). Had it not been for his tragic death in 2000, from complications brought on by a serious car accident, Thomas undoubtedly would have added to that total. But he has some of the same knocks as many candidates whose names are left to languish come Hall of Fame time. Thomas played on some good but not historic defenses, and he never appeared in so much as one Super Bowl. He'll get in eventually, but it might not be in 2007.
Michael Irvin, wide receiver
As with Norv Turner, Troy Aikman and Jerry Jones will amp up the public relations campaign for Irvin, who owns three Super Bowl rings and teamed with Aikman and Emmitt Smith to form the Dallas Cowboys' potent "triplets." Turner makes a good point about Irvin's performance against top competition – he was a good pressure player and more than held his own against Hall of Fame caliber cornerbacks. And there is some truth to Irvin's numbers being tempered as the offense got better and more of the game flowed through Emmitt and some of the ancillary weapons. Irvin's resume (750 catches, 15.9 yards-per-catch average, 65 touchdowns) weren't mind-blowing, but it should be pointed out that injury cut his career short. He had only one double-digit year in touchdown receptions and caught 65 scores in 12 seasons. But if Aikman got the benefit of the doubt for an offense that didn't generate huge passing stats, shouldn't Irvin share in that rationale? Some say yes. Bottom line, if voters care about the total package – numbers, championships and dominance in an era – then Irvin deserves the nod. But if they are factoring in Irvin's off-the-field issues, then 2007 could come and go with him staying home once again.
Art Monk, wide receiver
He played 16 NFL seasons, so he has the longevity thing working for him – and against him. In that span, Monk made the Pro Bowl only three times, which has been a major thorn in Hall of Fame voting, along with the fact that he produced five 1,000-yard seasons in that time and never caught more than eight touchdown passes in a regular season. His 68 total touchdowns aren't amazing for the number of years he played, either. Then again, he played a fair number of years in "The Posse" – forming a trio with Gary Clark and Ricky Sanders (which led to passing yardage and touchdowns being thinned out on the Redskins). He has three Super Bowl rings (though an injury sidelined him in Super Bowl XVII), put up a good performance in Super Bowl XXVII (seven catches for 113 years) and finished his career as the all-time leader in receptions. Unfortunately for Monk, that record was shattered long ago by Jerry Rice. Will he get in next year? If it's going to happen, this is a pivotal time – in what should be a weak class to contend with. But Monk has only made the top-10 cut once in the last three years (2005). If it doesn't happen in 2007, it could be a while.
Charles Robinson is Yahoo! Sports' national NFL writer. Send him a question or comment for potential use in a future column or webcast.
Updated on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 2:58 am EDT
By Charles Robinson, Yahoo! Sports
August 6, 2006
CANTON, Ohio – Maybe Norv Turner looks at Art Monk and frets over Michael Irvin's Pro Football Hall of Fame fortunes. Maybe he knows now is the time for an impassioned push. Or maybe he just sees other supposed shoo-in candidates on the horizon – like Washington Redskins great Darrell Green – and cringes at the thought of who will go in first.
"There are a couple of corners that are going to be up here in the next several years," Turner said, referring to Green's candidacy in 2008 and Deion Sanders' likely induction in 2010. "If they go in before Michael, it's not right. Because they never covered him. If a guy goes and catches nine balls for 160 yards on you, you shouldn't go in before him.
"Put on the Atlanta film in 1992. Michael wore Deion out down there. And we had to win a game to win the division. It's like what Al Davis said about John Madden. It took 25 years to get (Madden) into the Hall of Fame, and he has a winning record against seven (coaches) that are in the Hall of Fame."
And thus, the campaigning for Irvin began in earnest Saturday, with Turner banging the first drum only moments after Troy Aikman's induction speech. It's a beat that will be heard in various cities around the nation, with the next batch of Hall of Fame candidates likely to stir some of the most rousing debates in recent memory – from the annual Art Monk campaign in Washington to the pushes for Thurman Thomas in Buffalo and Derrick Thomas in Kansas City.
In fact, only one candidate appears to be an absolute lock in '07, and he's not even a former player. The one certain nod goes to the current NFL commish, Paul Tagliabue. That is, if he ever actually retires. (It should happen later this month).
So let the debate of greatness begin. Here is a look at some of the top candidates in 2007:
Paul Tagliabue, NFL commissioner
I know there are going to be some voters who grumble about the guy – and say he's riding the coattails of a league destined to blossom – but that's rubbish. The health and overall success of the game is more paramount than any statistical record in existence. So there shouldn't be much debate here, particularly after Tagliabue pulled off one of his crowning moments in the last round of rugged collective bargaining negotiations. Other feathers in his cap: The NFL's stadium infrastructure has been practically reborn under his watch; the league has risen to unparalleled profitability and popularity in American sports; he has helped the NFL avoid the labor pitfalls and scandals that have floored the NBA, NHL and Major League Baseball. Tagliabue has had as much of an impact in his era as Pete Rozelle did in the previous regime. Enough said. Put him in.
Bruce Matthews, offensive lineman
Despite the lack of Super Bowl hardware, Matthews was clearly one of the best offensive lineman in his era, tying a league record with 14 consecutive Pro Bowls in 19 seasons (the other guy to achieve that honor, Merlin Olsen, has been enshrined). Matthews has the kind of credentials that Hall of Fame voters like – he played his entire career for one franchise; he played all three positions on the line over his career and made the Pro Bowl as both a tackle and center; and he blocked for a Hall of Famer in Earl Campbell (not to mention Eddie George in his latter years with the Tennessee Titans). The one thing that will be held against him and could even keep him out on the first ballot (weird things happen with the voters) is the lack of a Super Bowl ring. But Olsen didn't have one, either, and for that matter, neither did Anthony Munoz, who was the other great tackle during Matthews' era. Both of those guys went in as soon as they were eligible, and Matthews should be a first-ballot guy, too.
Thurman Thomas, running back
Thomas had five Pro Bowl appearances and eight consecutive 1,000-yard seasons – and of course, four unsuccessful Super Bowl appearances. While he never won a league rushing title, people tend to forget that he was Marshall Faulk before you ever heard of Marshall Faulk. Thomas led the league in yards from scrimmage from 1989 to 1992 – a span in which he averaged an impressive 10-plus yards per catch on 229 receptions. And no doubt about it, he was the trigger for Buffalo's Run-N-Shoot offense. The problem voters are going to have with Thomas? He doesn't have a great deal of marquee moments, didn't put up great numbers in his Super Bowl appearances and averaged less than four yards per carry in his last four 1,000-yard seasons. It probably won't be his year in 2007. And if it isn't, he might begin to fade as his glory years get further away.
Bob Kuechenberg, offensive lineman
A six-time Pro Bowler who spent his entire 15-year playing career with the Miami Dolphins (including the undefeated 1972 team), Kuechenberg has been on the cusp of induction the last few years. He made the cut to the top 10 candidates three of the last four years, including 2006. Among the attractive qualities for voters is the fact that he was considered one of the best (some say the best) guards of his era and he blocked for multiple Hall of Famers in Dan Marino, Bob Griese, Paul Warfield and Larry Csonka. One other factor: Having been eligible since 1990, he's nearing the end of his active term and appears to be close to induction, which may sway some votes in his favor. That may be the trick in 2007.
Derrick Thomas, linebacker
Amassing 126½ sacks and earning Pro Bowl honors in nine of his 11 seasons with the Kansas City Chiefs, Thomas was one of the most dominant pass-rushing linebackers of his era, if not NFL history. He holds the single-game sack record, notching seven against Seattle (the Chiefs lost the game, a fact which might be brought up among voters). Had it not been for his tragic death in 2000, from complications brought on by a serious car accident, Thomas undoubtedly would have added to that total. But he has some of the same knocks as many candidates whose names are left to languish come Hall of Fame time. Thomas played on some good but not historic defenses, and he never appeared in so much as one Super Bowl. He'll get in eventually, but it might not be in 2007.
Michael Irvin, wide receiver
As with Norv Turner, Troy Aikman and Jerry Jones will amp up the public relations campaign for Irvin, who owns three Super Bowl rings and teamed with Aikman and Emmitt Smith to form the Dallas Cowboys' potent "triplets." Turner makes a good point about Irvin's performance against top competition – he was a good pressure player and more than held his own against Hall of Fame caliber cornerbacks. And there is some truth to Irvin's numbers being tempered as the offense got better and more of the game flowed through Emmitt and some of the ancillary weapons. Irvin's resume (750 catches, 15.9 yards-per-catch average, 65 touchdowns) weren't mind-blowing, but it should be pointed out that injury cut his career short. He had only one double-digit year in touchdown receptions and caught 65 scores in 12 seasons. But if Aikman got the benefit of the doubt for an offense that didn't generate huge passing stats, shouldn't Irvin share in that rationale? Some say yes. Bottom line, if voters care about the total package – numbers, championships and dominance in an era – then Irvin deserves the nod. But if they are factoring in Irvin's off-the-field issues, then 2007 could come and go with him staying home once again.
Art Monk, wide receiver
He played 16 NFL seasons, so he has the longevity thing working for him – and against him. In that span, Monk made the Pro Bowl only three times, which has been a major thorn in Hall of Fame voting, along with the fact that he produced five 1,000-yard seasons in that time and never caught more than eight touchdown passes in a regular season. His 68 total touchdowns aren't amazing for the number of years he played, either. Then again, he played a fair number of years in "The Posse" – forming a trio with Gary Clark and Ricky Sanders (which led to passing yardage and touchdowns being thinned out on the Redskins). He has three Super Bowl rings (though an injury sidelined him in Super Bowl XVII), put up a good performance in Super Bowl XXVII (seven catches for 113 years) and finished his career as the all-time leader in receptions. Unfortunately for Monk, that record was shattered long ago by Jerry Rice. Will he get in next year? If it's going to happen, this is a pivotal time – in what should be a weak class to contend with. But Monk has only made the top-10 cut once in the last three years (2005). If it doesn't happen in 2007, it could be a while.
Charles Robinson is Yahoo! Sports' national NFL writer. Send him a question or comment for potential use in a future column or webcast.
Updated on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 2:58 am EDT